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Value studies of a skull - help! I might be value blind - Chris P - 11-05-2014
I'm trying to do a value study of a skull (see attached pictures).
Unfortunately I seem to suffer from a medical condition that makes me unable to distinguish values.
In other words: I don't know how to do this and I am getting really frustrated, because I know it isn't turning out right, but I don't understand what I can do differently in order to improve it.
I think I have (at least) two problems: I can't really choose values to match what I am seeing (e.g. the left side of the skull that is in shadow seems to always come out too dark in relation to the other values in the picture) - and I fail to see bigger areas of light and darkness (I know in theory that I should be looking for big areas of light and big areas of shade first, before going into details. But when I look at the real skull I just don't see it. I have the same problem when painting hair: I just see the local color of the hair and the individual strands, but no bigger forms).
In this case I am working with acrylics. But I have the same problems when working digitally or with a pencil, so I don't believe it is a problem with the medium.
RE: Value studies of a skull - help! I might be value blind - Caisne - 11-05-2014
Man, 3rd attempt already looks better than the first for me. Just practice. And if you're looking for the perfect tutorial, in your case it would be Michael Bierek - The Mystery of Form
RE: Value studies of a skull - help! I might be value blind - Patrick Gaumond - 11-05-2014
Your values aren't that bad. They work relative to each other and show the form, however I think the problem at the moment is that you're trying to use the whole, or most, of the grayscale, across the whole skull. Try instead to use only 3 or 4 values, starting with only 2 (light and shadow) and then adding in more values as you go. If you dont see the form emerging just from 2 values, move your light. Your light is squarely illuminating half of the skull. Try moving it so a bit of light catches the far side of the skull
take a look at these figure drawings. Notice how distinct the light and shadow side are. That's because once the initial line sketch laying out the proportions was done, the artist then drew in a shadow shape and filled it in with a flat value, then slowly pushed the values outwards until the forms read. Its surprising how much information you can show just from 2 values.
http://media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/1d/e8/f1/1de8f1d871ff1ea666ea83eb18a3f2c2.jpg
http://media-cache-ec0.pinimg.com/236x/da/b0/dc/dab0dc6265f37103701dd22bcd1945c5.jpg
These videos might also help.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-dqGkHWC5IU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0pVufSOk61I
If you already know that you should be looking for the big light and dark shapes first but aren't doing so, there's not much we can do to help! It's really down to you to force yourself to do it even if you don't like it or don't think you can do it. Try using only 2 values as I said earlier, maybe then you will be forced to see the bigger picture first then you can work outwards.
also if you're not satisfied with acrylic, try switching to another medium like charcoal which is much easier to control, especially for grayscale, than paint; at least until you get a good understanding of value. I know you said you don't think its medium specific, but charcoal/soft pencils are objectively simpler and easier to control a grayscale in than in paint. Might make a big difference! If you decide to try out pencil again, check out this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D_W9sZ8S7RM. He shows how to sharpen a pencil for easy shading and such, if you don't already do so
Hope that helps and good luck!
RE: Value studies of a skull - help! I might be value blind - Adam Lina - 11-06-2014
^what he said. Also have you tried squinting to see shadow shapes?
RE: Value studies of a skull - help! I might be value blind - Chris P - 11-06-2014
Thank you for your advice (all three of you)!
I'm going to watch those videos you recommended.
I drew the same skull with pencil and only two values today. When I got to the last one (the one at the bottom of the page) it actually started to be fun. I'll keep you updated with my progress.
RE: Value studies of a skull - help! I might be value blind - Patrick Gaumond - 11-06-2014
Good stuff man! Looks like you're already getting a good handle on this
RE: Value studies of a skull - help! I might be value blind - Chris P - 11-24-2014
I need some advice: am I taking this in the right direction? (see attached picture)
I am really having trouble judging whether I am learning and improving with this. It still feels like I don't know at all what I am doing. Should I just practice more, even if it feels like mindless repetition? Should I change my approach? Should I go back and do more studies with just two flat values before adding more values?
RE: Value studies of a skull - help! I might be value blind - Caisne - 11-24-2014
How many hours a day do you put into drawing stuff?
Even when working with lines, try to thing about what is closer to you and what is further. Use line weight. The closer to us - the thicker the line is, the further that shit from use - the thinner the line is. Check the tut about the subject from SCORO https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x0zl5NnEAyU
Did a quick Paint over for your bones. Watch the line weight!
RE: Value studies of a skull - help! I might be value blind - Patrick Gaumond - 11-25-2014
The forms are slowly starting to read better. These things take time, don't expect to "see" improvement from one study to the next. I've always found that improvement comes in sudden jolts, often after you've changed subject matter for a while.
So what I'd suggest doing is maybe spend 30-60 each mins drawing skulls from different angles and lighting setups a day for a week. Do that as a warmup for maybe 2-3 hours a day. Then try doing 1 or 2 from memory without looking at reference. A strong sense of shadow shapes will develop when you have to do it from memory, since those shapes are basically the simplified version of the actual forms. After you've done that for a week, change subject matter. You can spend a whole year drawing the same thing over and over again, and maybe that's the way to go for you. But I've always found that I learn more when I change topics often. You'll pick up little techniques and ideas that you can bring over to your skull studies, and hopefully see some change.
Most importantly is to be patient and persistent. Draw/paint everyday, even if some days you can only manage 20 mins. Keep the ball rolling but change it up from time to time, so your brain can absorb the information. When you eat, do constantly stuff your face with the same meal 24 hours a day, or do you break it up, vary what you eat and allow yourself to digest?
RE: Value studies of a skull - help! I might be value blind - karipaints - 11-25-2014
If you are just getting a grip on values, I would start drawing cylinders and spheres and move to the medium you are most comfortable with (even digital, just once you are done with that go straight back to traditional and try it all over again).
I tried to read through most of the replies, so sorry if this is mentioned already, but the way I check color and value is by picking comparison points. For example:
Is the brightest point of the nose as bright as the brightest point of the brow bone?
Is that shadow under the cheek as dark as the nostril?
Oh, the socket of the eye is as dark as the shadow under the cheek next to the nose.
This is not the most scientific of methods and can result in inaccurate values, but if done right will be believable and can help later when using reference for different projects. This doesn't mean you shouldn't also learn a more accurate method, this is just one type of approach.
Another thing is that you're working with paint that is pretty dark. Paint your background first (maybe try an almost-black for that top-left-corner background, a light midtone for the background paper area, and good luck trying to nail that metallic board. If you can,change it out for a piece of cardboard or something since you're new to getting value right). It's going to be SO much harder for you to paint the right values for an object that's not sitting on (or next to) the values it's surrounded by. They are, after all, affecting how the light bounces off the skull in the first place. AND how your human eye sees color.
Hope that was helpful and not confusing. Also, everyone else's replies are awesome :D
RE: Value studies of a skull - help! I might be value blind - Chris P - 11-26-2014
Thanks for the encouragement and advice! Just what I needed! You are the best!
I'm taking a short break from these studies while I am on a vacation trip. I'll be back with more skulls around December 15. Last batch before the break: a pair I did from memory last night, and one more skull I did from the real thing today.
Quote:How many hours a day do you put into drawing stuff?About one or two hours after work on most days.