Hristov Trials
#1
Hey there! Decided to start a new SB exploring what I'm really interested at.. which is illustration and character design.
For years I kind of put it on a side, since I treated it as the "desert" / saving it for last in order to  become a well rounded artist .... But in reality was delaying something I always loved for doing stuff I don't really enjoy, was a very stupid decision.

So yeah.. here I go, I'm practicing anatomy and drawing, hopefully soon I would have a illustration portfolio and start freelancing again.

First illustration bellow is still work in progress, the rest is just studies I've done last month.
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#2
Hey, my SB got a ton of text from chatting and joking  - which is great I love catching up with old friends and making new ones ! However it was a little bit hard to follow along my progress over the weeks,  so i compressed everything into 2 posts - so nothing gets lost but at the same time is less distracting.

We can still chat as much as we want , I'm just gonna re-arrange my sb so it doesn't look chaotic haha

(03-03-2021, 05:32 AM)darktiste Wrote: Mariyan-Hristov what exactly is stopping you exept time.Time can be an excuse not to push yourself to new level just consider it.Some people work on piece of art during many session because of there shedule what make them any different than you?Are you following a course and need to produce a certain set amount of drawing or are you free to take your time and try on new challenge?Always consider the benefit over the limitation you have on yourself. If need be you can always probably find way to sacrifice sometime elsewhere and work on art but your the only one who know what is the best use of your time.I think this might just be an issue of how you perceive short piece gain vs long piece gain.There a general notion that more drawing = faster improvement.But remember that improvement also require breaking limit such as working in a certain way.

Thanks for the concern dude!! However this is not true at all. If one does daily studies with a time limit - For example everyday for a year, with time you start to clear your process from mistakes and gain a sense of what is important , essential and what is not.

If you do a small study everyday, that is 365  chances to not repeat the same mistake and slowly clear most of them. After the 20th time you make the same error , you start to really get pissed.

While if you do 20-30 studies per year, you have only 20-30 chances to fix mistakes. It also means that the studies you do are too complex, which is a sign  that a person studies aimlessly.

If you are going to make a portfolio which took you 3 weeks per piece and a studio hires you , you are basically screwed big time , because they would expect you to do it for 3 to 5 days.

Believe me its better to create a worse looking portfolio, where the paintings took 3 days per image, than a portfolio where things took you 14-20 days per image. Nobody is gonna be waiting that long if the standard is 3 to 5 days and on top of that if they want revisions - that is few more weeks of waiting.

The artist's you talk about who take a ton of sessions to finish something, do it while working on personal paintings, not studies. Taking long sessions on studies makes no sense ,  because the whole point is to learn to make something fast for an image or a revision in a working environment. In a working environment its always better to make something finished, than making it perfect.

Also I feel that this notion of constantly making " a little bit more time to study"  will certainly burn you out and ruin your schedule to draw everyday. So yeah, I think you have very good intention's and I thank you for that !! However  I think what you said is more idealistic, than practical - especially for people who want to make a living out of it.




(03-03-2021, 02:48 PM)JosephCow Wrote:
(03-03-2021, 06:49 AM)Mariyan-Hristov Wrote:  If you do a small study everyday, that is 365  chances to not repeat the same mistake and slowly clear most of them. After the 20th time you make the same error , you start to really get pissed.

 While if you do 20-30 studies per year, you have only 20-30 chances to fix mistakes. It also means that the studies you do are too complex, which is a sign  that a person studies aimlessly.

 If you are going to make a portfolio which took you 3 weeks per piece and a studio hires you , you are basically screwed big time , because they would expect you to do it for 3 to 5 days.

Believe me its better to create a worse looking portfolio, where the paintings took 3 days per image, than a portfolio where things took you 14-20 days per image. Nobody is gonna be waiting that long if the standard is 3 to 5 days and on top of that if they want revisions - that is few more weeks of waiting.

Sorry if this is stupid, I'm barely even trying to follow this conversation lol

I wonder if you could expand on these points, because I think that's kind of interesting. It makes sense, but then also quality over quantity is a thing.  Like you wouldn't want to just churn out crappy, quick drawings thinking you'll just do it better next time. I would think it would be generally better to do what you have to do in order to make each one as right as you can, even if it takes longer than you would like, and let the speed come as a consequence of getting better. But obviously different situations could mean going about things a different way.


But maybe that's a better strategy for learning the basics of something properly, and you're working on things beyond that, in a more professional sense. I dunno. Obviously you know what you're doing way better than me, so don't take this as a critique or anything. I just wonder if what you're talking about is an approach i should do more of for my own goals.
Oh wow, so much text haah :)

 Ok, Quallity vs Quantity.

First of all its not about quantity at all imo.  Its about "situations" , you collect and solve situations - arms from different angles, materials with different lighting etc. - basically trying to solve any object or subject in different conditions.
Why do this ? Because this way you start to get the essence of things and how to play with them.

While complex studies are - just one situation with many specific factors. Specific pose, proportions, lighting, material qualities, expression etc. whit which you lose a lot of time. Why not make portfolio images, than long studies? You still test  your abilities and understanding into something more complex. With the only difference that a portfolio could be used for jobs and you can't do shit with a complex study. Its good to do them  from time to time, just to test if you can create a workflow with all the knowledge you have , but that is it.
 I think its better to do " fast " studies and portfolio images - which  can serve the purpose of doing a long study. Than to do long studies and then portfolio images which is a overkill.


Another reason why it's not about quality vs quantity is that you do it because you understand you have limited time in everyday life. I don't try to be fast at all, I really don't, I try to solve a problem simple enough within a time frame. Like the first time I do a study I might take few hours more, just to test if I get the concept. Afterwards I try to see how long it  takes a professional to do it and set a similar time limit. If one can't do it and feels they are rushing things and don't know how to solve a few things , this means they lack some basic fundamental tool and need to go back problem shoot and try find what that is and do small studies on that. If you don't set limit for your studies you can basically draw forever and think that you are improving , but it might also be that after drawing 231321132 and fixing some mistake, you did  kind of drew something which kind of solves the problem. However if its 231321132 attempts to 1 success in a signle image, it means you were just lucky( you didn't make choice or solved anything) .

And like I said with time you clear your process and things start to look better and better, especially if the people you compete with ( concept artist's, illustrations etc.) do it for that set time.


@JosephCow - " you wouldn't want to just churn out crappy, quick drawings thinking you'll just do it better next time"  Yes but that is if one thinks in terms of Quallity vs Quantity. I don't think in those terms.  I try to realize that I need to have experience solving situations (objects or subjects in different views lighting etc.) withing a time frame.  I try to do a study, not a masterpiece, not an image people should admire, but something which tests my understanding within reason. And the reason you are basically testing your brain and knowledge in different situations is so when that time comes and a client approaches you, you have some idea how to solve their request's because you did studies in similar situations and have at least a basic idea how to go around what they want. From my experience every image i was tasked with had some unique challenge and had something where the quality had to be pushed( Way more than what I was used to) this alone takes extra time and effort to solve. If you add on top of that stuff you have to problem solve in conditions you had no experience with,  its very likely you would either burn yourself or miss the deadline.

The thing I realized was that in personal images or work where you have more time its great to push your image to its absolute best.  But for jobs the most important thing is for a task to be finished and to be good ENOUGH, not perfect.

Nobody really knows what is in your head except you, only you can compare that you did which is ok  vs what was in your head which was "insanely good". So nobody is going to get pissed at you. Just try to make the process simple for yourself , so the client knows they are getting the image they need.

(03-09-2021, 09:02 AM)Skeffin Wrote: Great anatomy studies as always. And that long debate you were having was pretty useful, made me feel better that my main improvement so far pre-schoolism has been churning out the same stuff only faster.

When you say that "Afterwards I try to see how long it  takes a professional to do it and set a similar time limit", how do you go about finding that information, and how general are we talking here? Knowing how fast you're expected to produce things in industry is one of my concerns as I feel I am slow. I've heard that detailed pieces they expect 8 hours to produce, however you mention a turn around of 3-5 days which seems far more reasonable
Thanks ! Well it really depends on the company and what standards they set for themselves.



For example 2 companies might give you 3 days for the same task using the same brief. However one's quality demands might be very light and the other studio's demands to require years of experience in order to finish the task.

If you cant understand what I mean, imagine this example( obviously not in 3 day time frame) - Imagine giving the same task of a Marvel  movie fight scene to a low budget vfx studio and to Weta Digital.


Its not an exact science sometimes they want five loose concepts for an hour, sometimes the best you could possibly do within a day and you have to work overtime.

In general, my rule is to make my new portfolio take between 1 to 3 days per image, altho when clients talk to me (at least in my case)  the timeline they assume is 3-5 days per image.

As for how I compare myself trying to set a time limit. I ask friends who work the same things I do. Also some of my favorite artist's are on discords servers I follow , so I DM them.  So when I get an answer , I try to compare my image quality within a time frame vs somebody else's who follows the standards of the client they work for.
Of course that doesn't mean people would be honest when they answer and you have to ask for images they did on the job, not personal pieces.

Usually I asked for schedules(if they work from home) , not for time per image ,because I got that from interviews from the people I like or I had already asked them in their streams.

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