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JyonnyNovice - from Novice to Master! - Printable Version

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RE: JyonnyNovice - from Novice to Master! - darktiste - 10-30-2020

What i see as a problem is actually the leak of cast shadow that would add that dark vibe in my opinion also your scene should get much darker as it get away from the light source of course that if we talking about a night scene where the moon or the sun ain't adding an other light source to the scene.I think that if you want to test if it work you should first do the version initial in black and white and than work from there than actual filling in using value instead of just the line art.Skipping over directly to color isn't helping if your value aren't solve thoughtfully.

One thing i would also think would help you is for you to think about filling more dark because black help sell the idea it a night scene so you would leave your detail in the white.

I would also suggest you take alook at comic with similar story and mood.


I would personally suggest hellboy as a starting point or spawn i think they really capture the idea of the occult and night feel. 

Here an example from hell boy to help illustrate more what i mean if you want to study from comic i recommend you either go to your local liberary or maybe you can find website that let your read online for free.

I think as a comic artist your biggest problem is to plan so that your not over rendering but actually just saying what is necessary to give the right mood and communicate the action.For example if you look at the example provided there is little to no background because it all about the action at that point .It more about implying texture than over rendering.


RE: JyonnyNovice - from Novice to Master! - JyonnyNovice - 10-31-2020

Chubbycat Thanks for the feedback! Definitely a case of having looked at it too long when colouring the streetlights, I totally get you!

Darktiste Thanks for taking the time to give feedback! Totally agree, and spotting blacks is a major weakness for me, whenever I try I end up with ugly and confusing images that doesn't read anymore. Need to work on that definitely, I'd love to get to a point where it works in black and white ink only then colour is just adding mood. I study Hellboy for his panel layouts, and definitely he's a master of gothic occult mood! This comic is a bit more 'Nancy Drew' than 'Hellboy', but can still gain a lot studying Mignola.


Re posting those pages (and the newest one) as spreads, since that's how they'll be published. Not sure if the colours & lighting work better like this or if I still have the same issues (too bright streetlights, not enough dark fall off)? 

Let me know : )

Probably the lack of any sky on page 3 doesn't help, I'll try increasing the light fall off or use stronger cast shadows there.

I do need to bear in mind that when it's printed everything looks darker and there's lower contrast, so I can't get too dark in the BG if I want people to see the details. Already the tree/bushes/sky on the last page may merge too much.

[attachment=118903]

[attachment=118904]


RE: JyonnyNovice - from Novice to Master! - mieksta - 10-31-2020

Man, I really have a lot of respect for comic artists. The amount of commitment needed is insane. Especially if they're doing the writing and drawing. I looked through a lot of your book and the progress you've made since 2014 is remarkable. If I had one suggestion it would be to look into drawing using shadow shapes. The biggest gap between your stuff(which is great) and that hellboy strip is that, that artist used shadows to emphasize form. I think it would really add some spice to your work if you learned how to do it like he did it there.


RE: JyonnyNovice - from Novice to Master! - JyonnyNovice - 11-03-2020

Mieksta Thanks for the comment! I do write some of it, without having someone relying on me I don't think I'd ever get it done. It is tons of work and the reward is so far away >.< not quite as masochistic as solo animation but it definitely makes you grind! Totally agree with your crit too, I decided now is the time to work on that stuff!


Making a new goal to get better at spotting blacks in backgrounds and characters/painting with shadow shapes/making things read as black and white only.

Did a couple character illustrations from reference first:

[attachment=118943]

[attachment=118942]


In the anime style one, in the end I think the version without the background works best, I felt like it wasn't really adding anything. Other people have said they like the BG version one tho so idk. I count them as moderate successes anyway, the character shadows worked out ok, but the black and white BG it's not clear if those are mountains/trees/something else behind her. Will probably do some pure environment studies to tackle that.

Next part of the training is to get a similar level of finish when not working straight from a single reference. Sketched out a couple of illustration ideas that I'm planning to develop so I can work on the shadow shape stuff in this kind of situation.

[attachment=118944]

Decided to turn the characters into Zelda and Link because why not, it was looking too much like a stock photo before >.<

[attachment=118945]

Some kids on a slide to prepare for more blacks/shadow shape training.

[attachment=118946]


RE: JyonnyNovice - from Novice to Master! - darktiste - 11-03-2020

Hi Jyonny maybe i can offer you an additional boost to your effort since you seem to want to pick up on what i suggested you tackle.I am not exactly sure if you aware of this channel or not but i think it would be a good addition to the resource you could draw knowledge from this guy as a insane amount of comic related content that should complement your knowledge nicely.

https://www.youtube.com/c/RobertMarzullo/videos


RE: JyonnyNovice - from Novice to Master! - JyonnyNovice - 11-07-2020

Darktiste Thanks for the recommendation! I watched this guy some years ago but had forgotten about him, gonna go and study his techniques a bit!


Got some really good news yesterday, I pitched my Penny Pentagram comic to Macroverse (a new-ish subscription based comic reading app with some big names attached) and have been accepted onto their platform \^_^/ It means I will need to step up production and work on my speed since 6 pages every 2 months is not enough anymore, but is much better pay than the print comic I currently publish in (and I can continue to publish on both). The current werewolf story is already pencilled, but for the next one I am going to attempt to do it in a much more direct way. The art quality may suffer, but it may also improve since there can be more sketch-like energy to it. We'll see how it goes...

Here's an update on some recent stuff, I finished the final spread for this part of the story. I tried removing the ink lines altogether to leave this vector graphic type look to the characters. Not sure if I only like it cause it's a change from seeing the linework all the time. Let me know if you like the with or without the linework version! If I went no linework I'd have some missing details to add, but maybe it looks better... idk xD

Shape Version:
[attachment=118996]

Ink Version:
[attachment=118995]

Also have been commissioned to do the cover of the next issue. Not sure if the thumbnail is too small but it's a giant ghostly werewolf holding the characters in the palm of its hand. Haven't got the right pose for the characters yet.
[attachment=118997]

A random WIP of a guy with a gun, going to try out some of Robert Marzulo's inking techniques on it:
[attachment=118994]

And some progress on my random Zelda fanart cafe scene. Zelda already ate 5 ice creams and is ordering another one. Going to use this piece to practice using solid blacks in the background.
[attachment=118993]


RE: JyonnyNovice - from Novice to Master! - Zorrentos - 11-10-2020

Everything is looking really good, but the Zelda piece is turning out amazing! I really love how well you are able to do the perspective by now! The comic pages must be paying off in terms of mileage! :)

As for the werewolf cover. It's hard to read the shapes because the size is so small, but the poses should IMO have a feeling of "preparing to defend themselves" since the werewolf is portrayed as an ominous, symbolic danger in this cover. I made a small overpaint of the approach I would take:

[attachment=119026]

Keep up the good work and keep posting!  Thumbs_up


RE: JyonnyNovice - from Novice to Master! - JyonnyNovice - 11-11-2020

Zorrentos Thanks for the comment/feedback/paintover! I should've posted more progress on that cover since I was further along, but pretty much went the route you were suggesting anyway. 

The second character behind her is more subdued to try and be more comedic, like he's doing a double take type of thing while she's 'ready for danger' but totally facing the wrong way.

I cropped out the werewolf a bit, since I thought the character's could be a bit bigger on the page. Making them smaller and the werewolf bigger would make things more oppressive/threatening but I want to show the characters too. 

I pretty much hate it at this point >.< feels like there's a ton of opportunity I'm missing out on but not really sure where to focus. I like the character poses, I dislike the werewolf, it feels to me like no improvement on the thumbnail, even that it's worse now I added detail. I like the giant moon/circle shape.

Desperately looking for feedback if anyone has any suggestions ^^

[attachment=119036]


RE: JyonnyNovice - from Novice to Master! - xelfereht - 11-11-2020

Hey Jyonny,
What gets me about all three characters on the page is they all look close to neural as far as their emotive quality.
the wolf has quite a relaxed looking hand and the face doesn't look too menacing.
the girl is looking the way shes got her guard up, so its as if shes already locked on to an opponent.
by moving her sight angle a bit you can get the feel shes ready but doesn't know where its gonna come from.
My suggestion for the guy is to give him the feel that hes sensed something is behind him but apprehensive to look
you can also make the characters a little bigger on the page to give them more significance and have their expressions read easier.
those are my quick suggestions  Thumbs_up

as for the lines or no lines, I think they both can work, the no lines is working particularly well at giving this a night time feel on things like the wolf where clean details would be diminished by the lack of light.

congratulations on the new opportunities beginning, rise to the occasion and make it work, fail fast and often,  and learn fast friend.

[Image: po_for_jyonny_novice_by_andrew_gibbons_d...NR6ClLcGCU]


RE: JyonnyNovice - from Novice to Master! - JyonnyNovice - 11-16-2020

Xel Thanks man, that was so useful, really kickstarted me back into this! Got so much from your paintover, can't thank you enough : )


Been doing plenty of studies and work on fundamentals, big weaknesses for me are environments, so trying to get a daily-ish habit of simplifying environments from photos
[attachment=119053]


Some more work on the cover, made the more angry werewolf expression as Xelf suggested but then toned it down a little to try and make him more smug, but also dangerous. Pushed the character expressions and poses too. Then have been flailing around trying to colour it. I went too complex I think and toned it back down again in the last image on the sheet below. That's where it's at currently. I feel I can do better though and will keep studying pro's and trying to apply that stuff to my work. Deadline is not til the end of the month so I have time to push it some more.
[attachment=119051]



Lastly, I really liked how the characters came out in the cover, and since I need to speed up with the comic pages I decided to redesign them with that more cartoony look, getting the underlying shapes as simple as possible so I can pose them quicker. I'm pretty happy with the man, still need to get a better design for the woman, some more straights against curves, better proportions and shapes overall, but I think it's getting there.
[attachment=119052]


RE: JyonnyNovice - from Novice to Master! - JyonnyNovice - 11-22-2020

Been getting serious with things again, managed to schedule in two 1 hour study sessions everyday. First one in the morning I've been studying character drawing, mainly Sean Galloway and how he designs clothing folds. Then my second study session is digital painting - finally tackling my colour/painting weaknesses head on. I've been following Woulter Tulp's 'Digital Painting Workout' exercises from Schoolism. Have been starting from scratch and getting back to values before moving on to colour (although did a couple of colour ones just to see what my capabilities are).

[attachment=119089]

Finished redesigning one of my main characters for the new comic:

[attachment=119090]
[attachment=119091]

And kind of finished the cover I was working on, at least it's at a point where I've pushed it as far as my abilities extend and am in a stage of endlessly fiddling with adjustments and filters so will just call it done and have to live with it!

[attachment=119092]

[attachment=119093]


RE: JyonnyNovice - from Novice to Master! - xelfereht - 11-23-2020

came out good, you did well pushing it forwards


RE: JyonnyNovice - from Novice to Master! - Artloader - 11-23-2020

Congats on the Macroverse deal Jynonny!  That sounds awesome - I really hope it takes off in a massive way for you :).

You seem to be building up some good momentum at the minute - I hope you manage to balance it all - don't forget to spend time recharging yourself too.

Your comic work is looking really good - what jumped out at me in particular was the variation in camera angles and your perspective work - it really adds depth and dynamism to my reading experience - great stuff dude!

The question of lines or no lines is an interesting one and it's one I'm trying to answer for myself as well.  I dunno - one day I think I prefer no lines and working in shapes and masses - but then the next day I'm loving the intricacies of line!

In either case what I find appealing is where I see well constructed forms and then a good handling of the lighting on those forms.  I've been equally blown away by artists who work in shapes and masses as well as those who work in line.

My current favourite comic book artist is Esad Ribic and his work is equally awesome whether he works in masses like this:


[Image: cafa8a5c05101d9648608af503f04a3c.jpg]

Or when he works in line, like this:

[Image: 094946afa08c7b7c11786448eb77e17f.jpg]

Anyway - just my few thoughts on this - probably nothing too helpful but thought I'd share anyway.

Keep it going dude!


RE: JyonnyNovice - from Novice to Master! - cgmythology - 11-26-2020

Really great updates here, I really enjoy your style in general! Love the recent Zelda Fan Art in particular, it's very solidly drawn, has great character expression, and a great style. I'd love to see it in colors so I hope you develop that even further! Keep up the great work!


RE: JyonnyNovice - from Novice to Master! - JyonnyNovice - 11-28-2020

Xelf Thanks man! means a lot ^^ 

Artloader I hadn't come across him before but I'm an instant fan now. Exploring a range of rendering/colouring styles I guess then is the best way and our personal style should kind of appear on it's own I guess? That solid drawing technique is the most important though, as professional painters are always saying!

CGMythology Happy to hear that my work has some kind of recognisable style to it! I guess it's like seeing photo's of family who look a bit like you, you can never see the similarities yourself. I should definitely finish that zelda piece, I have really bad stamina with personal work... I feel happy about something for a while then get filled with doubt and move on to something else.


Been busy studying and working on the comic, one more batch of 6 pages to finish then a break from it while we figure out the script for the next case.

Been continuing with Wouter Tulp's Digital Painting Workout. They're daily 30 minute painting exercises, although when he's finished I continue for a bit, maybe an hour max. Painting along with him is a bit of a struggle, trying to watch him, look closely at the reference and paint myself, so I definitely need to do some of the exercises again from my own reference. It's really helping me get my head around colour and value tho.

The goal for this one was to paint the correct values, but using random, highly saturated colours. The ones on the right are converted to greyscale to see how close I got. It's was a real brain twister but I think a really good exercise:
[attachment=119152]

This one is using colours to replicate the value range, but shifting it to a high key. Converted to greyscale at the end to check:
[attachment=119153]

Same as above but into a low key. This one doesn't feel as successful, needed to go a little brighter maybe in the roof and the bright spots on the floor.
[attachment=119155]

This one was to paint the foreground character with a full value range, everything else in a high key:
[attachment=119157]

Finally painted the focal point with full range values and high saturation, then fade it off into a high key/low saturation in the surrounding areas.
[attachment=119160]


Some warmup drawings from pinterest feed:
[attachment=119156]

[attachment=119158]

and some various anatomy studies. I bought a few books by Michel Lauricella who has really nice simplified anatomy forms:

[attachment=119154]

[attachment=119159]


RE: JyonnyNovice - from Novice to Master! - Artloader - 11-29-2020

Wonderful studies Jyonny - I'm really impressed with those saturated value studies - you've a great eye for value!
I'm also loving those hand constructions - nicely done!


RE: JyonnyNovice - from Novice to Master! - JyonnyNovice - 12-02-2020

Artloader I was really surprised when I made that thing greyscale and it sort of matched... was a really hard exercise, just squinting isn't enough, had to squint so hard I could barely see it and do a lot of test strokes of paint comparing just two colours to judge if it was going lighter or darker. Definitely worth doing I think!

Some more drawing studies/warmup stuff. I am challenging myself to not use any selection/move/transform tools for my drawing studies. I noticed I tend to draw stuff, almost knowing proportions are going to be off, then immediately select and scale/move/transform the arm/foot/head or whatever. This is fine for proper work, but I think it highlights a serious lack in my hand eye connection that I want to correct. So if I draw something wrong, I have to fade it back with a soft eraser and re-draw it. It's been frustrating but really useful, I already feel I am looking at the whole image more, holding back from adding details til the structure is solid and generally feeling more content with the results.

[attachment=119241]
[attachment=119244]

More Digital Painting Workout exercises:

Painting with a very limited value range (just 3% difference from lightest to darkest)
[attachment=119240]

Same limited value range in a high key. I don't think these were so successful, I didn't really understand what he was doing til about halfway through the video on the first one, and for the second one didn't know if I was supposed to be matching the colours or using whatever I liked (excuses excuses!). I need to do this exercise again basically.
[attachment=119242]

Painting cast shadows with hard edge, form shadows with soft edge
[attachment=119243]

Starting with a red BG and painting only light (no under sketch, the result was intended to look distorted). Trying to be prepared I did the under sketch before pressing play and learning we weren't doing one today xD all good practice tho!
[attachment=119245]


RE: JyonnyNovice - from Novice to Master! - Skeffin - 12-02-2020

These are some really nice studies, I like the simplification going on


RE: JyonnyNovice - from Novice to Master! - darktiste - 12-02-2020

Small head syndrome or stylistic choose?


RE: JyonnyNovice - from Novice to Master! - JyonnyNovice - 12-08-2020

Skeffin Thanks! I'm really aiming for the simplified approach, glad it's showing through!

Darktiste I made them tiny on purpose. I tend to draw heads too big usually I think, so drawing them small sometimes, I think, should help.


Some recent studies and practice things, my main time is put into the comic which I'll share here too when it's finished!

drawing warmup:
[attachment=119298]

Digital Painting Workout exercise painting coloured light:
[attachment=119295]

light from two sides:
[attachment=119296]

light from above:
[attachment=119297]

this exercise was to paint the reference as if it was a cool light instead of a warm one, so the cloth goes towards purple and shadows are warm instead of cool and reflected light changes. I felt mostly happy with this one, except for the shadows on the image right side of the skull, couldn't quite get the values/reflected light colour to work as I wanted.
[attachment=119299]

personal studies to get better painting skin:
[attachment=119300][attachment=119301]

Another exercise. We use a limited palette and mix them on that white rectangle like it was traditional paint. We are allowed to add black and white to any colour too to raise/lower value and reduce saturation. This first one I did with the video, but got all mixed up and the colour palette was way too broad and I don't think it's very harmonious:
[attachment=119302]

Tried another one on my own picking three starting colours. Choosing red yellow and orange was probably not the best choice, should've had a cooler colour in there but it was nice to paint without worrying about what colour to pick next, just trying out different mixes of my starting colours. I might paint like this for a while to try and get an appreciation of some limited colours instead of just nudging things around on the hue/sat/brightness sliders like usual. The shadows on the woman are not very successful, but on the whole there is definitely colour harmony across the image I think.
[attachment=119303]

Some initial exploring sketches for one of the next villain characters for our comic, an egyptian mummy/femme fatale type of villain. Will need to draw her in human form in a flashback sequence, as well as Cleopatra, and mummy form for the main action:
[attachment=119304]