This place is functionally the same as the old conceptart.org (post art, get criticisms and/or words of encouragement), so it should be what you're looking for.
Good energy in those sketches. I'd need to see more polished stuff to give a real critique though, if you want critiques.
Thank you for your reply. I totally want critiques, that's why I'm here, and advice on what to practice/read and how to practice. Also how can I best participate in here at my skill level?
Here is a self portrait from today and my more finished stuff from before my child-rearing hiatus.
"It's better to do the right thing poorly, then to do the wrong thing beautifully."
Child-rearing is a massive undertaking. I hope your kid(s) haven't been too challenging and that it hasn't been too hard to get back into drawing! Regarding how to best participate, there's really nothing to do but keep posting in your sketchbook, and leave feedback in the threads of other people if you want to. You could always post in the Seeking Critique forum if you want critique on a specific picture ASAP.
First of all, I love the painting of the elfish character in the forest with a unicorn. Lovely lighting and details of plants in the foreground; they're like botanical illustrations. This makes me think you already know what to shoot for in a painting, so I have no pointers to give in that area. There are some nicely defined forms in your self-portrait, too.
I get the impression that you have the most trouble with drawing full-body images and unusual angles of faces, especially since you start the thread with figure studies. There's nothing about your figures that I'd call incorrect though (unless I were to get nitpicky). Things like clavicles and other anatomical details are in basically the right place; there are just some shapes and proportions that look strange, but there are parts that look good, too.
Obviously I can't outright tell you what to practice, but I can tell you what has worked for me personally. Note: only listen to me if you think I know what I'm talking about based on my sketchbook posts. You don't want to follow false leads!
The most important thing is that any sort of figure drawing practice helps. 30 second sketches, 30 minute sketches, whatever. It's not strictly wrong to focus on one kind of practice, but doing a lot of something like gesture drawings can only help you so much when it comes to making fully detailed drawings. I've also found it helpful to focus on whatever's causing me the most trouble (e.g. drawing figures with blank heads when I'm having trouble with bodies, or focusing on limbs by themselves when I'm struggling with them). When studying from photos, what has worked best for me is not to look at the picture while drawing, but try to draw it from memory repeatedly.
When it comes to things like determining lengths of foreshortened body parts and how to make the thickness of them look correct, when I do not simply wing it like a lazy bastard, I often use techniques described in Burne Hogarth's Dynamic Figure Drawing book, some of which are also described in Andrew Loomis' Figure Drawing for All it's Worth. Since you asked for things to read, I recommend both. Just keep in mind that Hogarth was a comic artist and does not aim to teach you to draw realistic figures; he just describes ways of getting figures to look "right" when drawing from imagination.
If you think you need to work on anatomy more, I think that a good book for artists is Atlas of Human Anatomy for the Artist by Stephen Rogers Peck. It describes a lot of specific muscles but is not overly technical, and it contains pages full of neat little comparisons and simplifications of bone and muscle shapes that make them easier to remember.
Thank you for the thoughtful comment Pubic Enemy. The years of not being able to draw were very hard for me and I feel quite rusty.
I appreciate the kind words on the one forest picture. It took me quite a while, and that's also one thing that bothers me, I want to become way faster. I used photo reference for the plants, the fabric I referenced from Ingres' paintings and I've actually stolen the composition from Borovikovsky here: https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Datei:Boro...ukhina.jpg ...
So from your comments I take that my gesture drawings are nicely dynamic, my anatomical landmarks seem mostly correct, but some shapes are wrong and the proportions are occasionally wrong. There are problems with features on turned and tilted heads. (You can get as nitpicky as you feel like, by the way. ) Gesture drawing won't help me with learning to do finished stuff. I should focus on the things that I have the most trouble with (OMG, I should make a list of those XD). And it would help to draw from memory more.
Thanks for the book recommendations, I love book recommendations... and books. I avoided using Hogarth for years because I found his style just hideous, but now I feel that his style is actually really helpful for drawing from imagination. So I'll definitely study his books. And drawing comics is actually my goal.
I do those gestures because it was easy for me to integrate them in my daily routine. So here is today's 30 min of figure drawing. Today I was studying from How to draw by Robertson and messing with Clip Studio's perspective rulers.
"It's better to do the right thing poorly, then to do the wrong thing beautifully."
By the way, since you asked for help with English ...
Quote:So I would be grateful if you tell me when I phrase something weirdly
Should be:
Quote:So I would be grateful if you would tell me when I phrase something weirdly
If it's OK, I would also like to add some more resources for you to try with your gestures and figure drawing.
1. Proko is a really high quality teacher: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=74HR59yFZ7Y&t=122s
2. Michael Hampton's book: Figure Drawing Design and Invention. This method is great for constructing anatomy from simplified forms.
Also, I took the liberty of doing some research and a quick paint over for you of your Saturn piece as I felt there was a flaw in her head construction.
I thought that this was quite a difficult angle so personally I would always use reference for this (here's one I found for you)
as well as trying to construct the head in perspective using something like Loomis's methods. The main difference is that I moved the eyeball further back into her head. I also added in a shadow to the side of her nose just to indicate the plane change between the side of her nose and front of her cheek.
One thing I always like to do is draw in a sphere where I think the eyeball should go - this really helps me construct the eyelids so that they follow the contour of the eyeball.
Anyway - hope this all helps, if not please ignore :).
“Today, give a stranger one of your smiles. It might be the only sunshine he sees all day.” -- H. Jackson Brown Jr.
Leysan: I assumed the forest picture was heavily referenced. 99%+ of detailed realistic paintings are heavily referenced. The fact that you could execute it well shows a very good sensibility. Getting faster is partially a workflow thing, but it mostly comes with improving your skills overall.
Since you are open to nitpicking, I've redlined your picture of the cool dryad-like character. This is as much for my benefit as it is for yours, because it's a very cool pose and composition, and I wanted to figure it out more.
I decided that her face and most of her neck is good, so I just traced it. I went into scribble mode for her extremities because I didn't think they were real problem areas (and I'm lazy). I'll go over the areas I made significant changes to:
1. Hip area. It's too small for her torso in the original. I got the impression that her whole torso is flexed, so I moved it downward instead of backward when enlarging it. I tried to maintain her bony hip anatomy, since it looks cool.
2. Chest and shoulders. I thought her farther shoulder was too small for the angle we're seeing her chest at, so I equalized her shoulders a bit. I also thought the sternal ends of her clavicles didn't convincingly meet up with her sternum, so I moved them to the left. I might have over-done it, though.
3. Arms. Her left arm is good, so I mostly traced it. Her right arm is not bad either, but I thought it could be improved. The dark line of her biceps/coracobrachialis should have been extended into her torso, since they originate underneath the deltoid. Otherwise, I just changed the shape of the upper arm to be closer to what I'd expect to see. I over-did some anatomical details to make things clearer for me, but she's a lean and mean type anyway.
4. Neck. Neck is pretty good. The only thing I thought should be changed is that we should see the sternocleidomastoid of the other side.
It's possible that more of the tops of her shoulders should be seen to be consistent with her torso angle, but I think it works visually as it is.
Lastly, I am not actually an appointed arbiter of how things should look, so whether any of these things are a visual improvement or not is up to you. If you would like further explanation of anything, just ask.
Oh my, you two are awesome! Thank you for the paint overs.
Thanks for correcting my English too Artloader! Also thanks for the resources. Great advice with the eyeball and the side plane of the nose.
Your paint over looks great Pubic Enemy, the muscles on her right arm look off though. I was wondering why she looked weird, but you fixed it wonderfully. It's very helpful that you've written down what you changed and why. I'm not sure if I should actually rework it, it's so old. The character is my take on Zyra from League of Legends. It was a secret santa gift. I actually promised to finish it before my real life took over...
I continued with the line-of-action.com studies today and I picked up Hampton's book, so here's that.
"It's better to do the right thing poorly, then to do the wrong thing beautifully."
(04-15-2020, 06:14 AM)Leysan Wrote: Your paint over looks great Pubic Enemy, the muscles on her right arm look off though. I was wondering why she looked weird, but you fixed it wonderfully. It's very helpful that you've written down what you changed and why. I'm not sure if I should actually rework it, it's so old. The character is my take on Zyra from League of Legends. It was a secret santa gift. I actually promised to finish it before my real life took over...
I'm glad I wasn't totally off-track with that redline, haha. You're probably right about the right arm; I made mostly arbitrary changes. Personally, I never re-work old paintings. It's good to figure out how they could be fixed, but the best thing to do is use that new knowledge to start something new, in my opinion. Sorry to hear that you didn't have the opportunity to finish it.
Good to see that you've found a way to get some daily sketching in. I hope you're feeling less rusty!
Hello!
I think the vegetation on the fantasy one is pretty damn impressive, have you trained doing landscapes? The sailor moon one (I might be off base here with the setting ha ha) is the one most interesting to me because it feels a bit on the wizard side? Commanding the skies! Had never seen that (probably should had paid more attention with the show as a kid).
That book you mentioned... Story by McKee? What does it touch upon if I may ask?
Thank you Pubic Enemy. I wonder how long I can keep it up. I also didn't have a chance to look into other sketchbooks here a lot, but your figures look nice.
Thank you for the kind words Rotohail. No, I didn't train in landscapes. I would like to get better at environments and placing people into environments though. About that Sailor Moon fanart...I don't remember the show at all. It was a gift for a friend and I just thought it would look cool to let her do that to the clouds. I have no idea what she could do in the show.
I'm not sure if I can give a good review of the book now. I'm only at chapter 6. It talks about the structure of stories and also how to go about coming up with stories. There are a lot of examples from movies. And I like how he writes. I got it because Marshall Vandruff recommended it on his website: https://www.marshallart.com/HOME/reviews...rytelling/
I need to draw more from imagination, so here is an attempt. I feel like the arm is too short and the head is not actually resting on the sofa like I intended it. Also I find it difficult to make clean lines and draw clothing.
"It's better to do the right thing poorly, then to do the wrong thing beautifully."
Drawing from imagination is extremely hard. There's not much to do but try, fail, find pictures of whatever you were trying to draw and study them/draw from memory (or even just observe them), and then try again.
For what it's worth, I see a progression in your sketches from the first post to your most recent one. They have a more loose and confident look, and you've got some nice lines in the more finished sketches at the bottom, especially the one of the woman kneeling.
Hey there! On board with Public Enemy, and wanted to add, that pushing imaginative sketches will also help find weak spots, as well as further develop your ability to visualize. Such as the woman kneeling on the far right! There's value more almost so in creating a few imagined figures that are concentrated, than a dozen loosely considered.
Hey melodon, this is a very good advice that I should follow XD Those gesture sketches are from photo reference (line-of-action.com), I will try to post more from imagination next time.
Thanks for the kind words and advice Pubic Enemy. I actually felt like it was getting messier day by day, so thanks.
Last days I was studying How to draw by Robertson. It is quite tedious, but I would really like to be able to draw environments better. Also life drawing of my kids.
"It's better to do the right thing poorly, then to do the wrong thing beautifully."
Ahh, How to Draw. I did roughly the first third of the exercises and became too lazy to continue.
Family members are an invaluable resource for life drawing. The only problem with the kiddos is that they never stay still, but that makes them ideal for getting a sense of movement!
(04-18-2020, 07:22 AM)Pubic Enemy Wrote: Ahh, How to Draw. I did roughly the first third of the exercises and became too lazy to continue.
Yeah, it is so tiresome to do the exercises. But maybe I can make it manageable by interspersing them with fun stuff, which is for me figure drawing.
(04-18-2020, 07:22 AM)Pubic Enemy Wrote: Family members are an invaluable resource for life drawing. The only problem with the kiddos is that they never stay still, but that makes them ideal for getting a sense of movement!
I love children, their gestures and facial expressions are so unguarded and natural. I rarely see that in adults.
Here are some figures from imagination and some gestures with line-of-action.com (I stopped doing them every day). I should dress them so that my rudimentary anatomy knowledge doesn't show ;D
"It's better to do the right thing poorly, then to do the wrong thing beautifully."
Glad to see you doing more fleshed-out figures; you actually do have some good anatomy in there. You're getting better (to my eyes, anyway), so keep doing what you're doing!
It's a good approach to draw stuff you like in between the technical exercises; doing technical exercises non-stop is a great way to burn out within hours. You need to find a ratio you can live with.
I agree with you about the expressions of children vs. those of adults. Their free-spiritedness is a precious thing.
(04-20-2020, 02:37 AM)Pubic Enemy Wrote: Glad to see you doing more fleshed-out figures; you actually do have some good anatomy in there. You're getting better (to my eyes, anyway), so keep doing what you're doing!
It's a good approach to draw stuff you like in between the technical exercises; doing technical exercises non-stop is a great way to burn out within hours. You need to find a ratio you can live with.
I agree with you about the expressions of children vs. those of adults. Their free-spiritedness is a precious thing.
Thank you for all the encouragement! Here's a self portrait from photo for color exercise.
"It's better to do the right thing poorly, then to do the wrong thing beautifully."
