Zizka's Sketchbook (Nudity and Vulgarity, NSFW)
#81
Zizka, regarding the tops and bottoms of the cylinders, I could try to explain, but I think it would be more helpful for you to find some pictures of cylindrical objects (or observe them in real life) from various angles and trace them. In a perfect cylinder, the connecting lines will appear wherever they make a clean angle with the frontal face of the cylinder (as opposed to intersecting it in a perpendicular fashion). Which I think is the same spot as the far ends of the major axis, or greatest diameter of the ellipse. (Anyone, feel free to correct if that's wrong.)

Regarding that 2PP drawing in the bottom left. I don't think it's actually off (not significantly, anyway), it just looks weird because it's rectangular rather than square. Regarding that slanted line, I don't think it's actually that slanted; I attached an image where I think it could be drawn straight while still being in the intersection of those lines. It just looks that way because of the very small brush size, leading to pixel-level distortions. Any actual slantedness is most likely due to you being VERY slightly off when making lines with the line tool, which can be hard to avoid. Is that image you posted at the actual resolution you work at? If so, I suggest working at a bigger resolution to minimize confusion.


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#82
Quote:Any actual slantedness is most likely due to you being VERY slightly off when making lines with the line tool

This might sound conceited by I drew those freehand, no line tool :). So you flattered me and I felt like saying it.

Quote:Which I think is the same spot as the far ends of the major axis, or greatest diameter of the ellipse. (Anyone, feel free to correct if that's wrong.)

I'd also like confirmation of this as this is my understanding of it.

Quote:In a perfect cylinder, the connecting lines will appear wherever they make a clean angle with the frontal face of the cylinder (as opposed to intersecting it in a perpendicular fashion).

I'm not sure I understand the concept of "clean angle". I mean, I don't understand what it means in practical terms.
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#83
[Image: qPoR051.png]
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#84
(04-23-2021, 09:57 PM)Zizka Wrote: This might sound conceited by I drew those freehand, no line tool :). So you flattered me and I felt like saying it.

I'm jealous, LOL.

(04-23-2021, 09:57 PM)Zizka Wrote: I'm not sure I understand the concept of "clean angle". I mean, I don't understand what it means in practical terms.

Sorry about that, it was bad wording. I meant to say that you can't put the connecting lines anywhere besides the visible points of the greatest diameter without making a wrong-looking cylinder. You'll end up describing a narrow cylinder with a wide elliptical or circular face at the end. To demonstrate (cylinder traced from Loomis because I'm lazy, and it turns out that I cannot freehand an ellipse on a tablet even when literally tracing):

You can put the connecting lines here:




But not, say, here:




What I'm trying to say is that you'll have found the correct place for the connecting lines when you find the place to put them that doesn't get you a crappy-looking cylinder. Helpful, huh?
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#85
Ha ok, I see what you were getting at. Today's practice:
[Image: hKOE5uQ.png]
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#86
Today's practice:
[Image: Ige7GIC.png]
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#87
Yo zizka you should utilize those clown fish there good subject to practice the wrapping line concept since they have strip.Zebra are the more advance version if you want subject that help pratice form drawing.

I think i need to clear a misconception the idea that since you copy something you are not learning it not that truth.The problem with copying is that you are not necessarly concern about the why .What do i mean by the why it hard to explain but let me try.Let say you draw a hand but you don't know the anatomy of the hand and you copy one hand what you just did was draw a symbol of a hand.What do i mean by a symbol well you simply copied the 2d aspect you would probably not be able to draw your own hand in a other position because you where not bothered to learn the anatomy to draw the hand in various pose to better understand the 3d nature of the subject that mean that there a difference between copying and studying a subject.A copy is more about accuracy of fundamental will study are more about understanding a specific subject throught a serie of drawing.

You need a minimum of drawing that are not copy but rather about studying the subject to get a better overall understand of it nature and than translate it into your drawing from imagination.That doesn't mean straight out of nothing this where the real breakthrought from 2d symbolism to 3d happen. It not necessary to draw for imagination to reach it you could draw the same subject multiple time from different angle that would be a good step foward but still you could be trap in the 2d symbolism even there so the real thing to get out of this is if you want to progress you need to be able to draw your subject from many angle and to get there you need to learn anatomy construction method that will help you find landmark on the human body.For that i recommend book from andrew loomis.

Any plan to start to do more anatomy or value study?

oh et puis je vient de voir que tu parle francais alors si tu veux des explication en francais tu peu m envoyer un email.

My Sketchbook
The journey of an artist truly begin when he can learn from everyone error.
Teamwork make your dream work.
Asking help is the key to growth.
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#88
Well, that’s a what I’m trying to do with the clown fish with the wrap lines.

I understand your point regarding the hand. The goal is to construct everything from basic shapes when using imagination. Maybe it’s different for other people, but when I copy, I study. The objective isn’t to reproduce the hand perfectly but to scrutinise how it’s made, how long the fingers are, the shape of the palm and so on. I need to have an idea of which shape I need to use otherwise I could build hands which are deformed because I have no clue what I’m doing. That’s my take on it anyway.

Re: anatomy, I’ve asked Marian and he doesn’t think I’m ready yet and I agree. My understanding of basic shapes is still very, very raw so using them to try to build something would be raw.

Merci pour l’offre!
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#89
Practice for today:
[Image: 6rzXo6M.png]
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#90
Practice for today:
[Image: IVhElNv.png]
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#91
Practice for today:
[Image: 2ULZrKY.png]
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#92
Practice for today. Tired pen and pencil:
[Image: YgOtSa4.png]
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#93
Today's practice:
[Image: 6bjoM2N.png]
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#94
Don't just draw small parallel line draw also longer line or once you find the rythem for the shorter one and keep doing that regularly not to lose the eye muscle coordination.A good exercise in spacing is the last exercise crossing set of parallele line it useful it you want to draw crosshatching.

My Sketchbook
The journey of an artist truly begin when he can learn from everyone error.
Teamwork make your dream work.
Asking help is the key to growth.
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#95
I think you're saying (my interpretation):
A. Draw long parallel lines.
B. Something about rhythm which I don't follow.
C. The last exercise I did was good to learn crosshatching.

Practice for today:
[Image: Hxmx1Il.png]
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#96
By rhythm i just mean that you should transtion to longer line once you get good small confident straight line.

My Sketchbook
The journey of an artist truly begin when he can learn from everyone error.
Teamwork make your dream work.
Asking help is the key to growth.
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#97
Ah ok, gotcha.

[Image: Xvk8byl.png]
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#98
So I deleted the last post in an effort to be more concise. I wanted to ask why you pick the bright colours on dark bg to do these studies with? Now that your figures are starting to have shadow shapes added, I feel using dark lines on lighter background would be much more useful as you (I assume) begin to build up to more tonal drawings?

Another few questions. Why so much repetition of some of these single figure poses? Is there a specific process or guidance you are following here? I see line of action studies which are one first step, but then just linear contour drawing copies of often, the same pose over and over. Do you ever attempt to keep correcting a single drawing until it is more correct, or do you just start a new drawing every time? How long do you spend on these? Do you vary the time?  What's your primary goal with these figure studies, is it to draw what you see accurately, or maybe to understand the human figure? It can be both ofc, but often these require different approaches to be learned best.

It appears you are trying to gain more accuracy to the specific references by linear outlining of form, than analysing of the form itself, perhaps. Also I can see you are checking accuracy against the ref after the fact, which is good, but then, what do you do to solve these inaccuracies as they arise in the next drawing? Do you attempt to measure and check during each drawing or only check and measure more specifically once a drawing is done?

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#99
Great feedback, as usual:

Quote:I wanted to ask why you pick the bright colours on dark bg to do these studies with?

I find it easier on the eyes. I find a bright background unpleasant to work on. But I'll change the color background if only to try something different.

Quote:Do you ever attempt to keep correcting a single drawing until it is more correct, or do you just start a new drawing every time?

I used to correct my drawings every time. I used to draw, more the layer over the reference to see what was wrong, move the drawing back then draw again and repeat the process until it look right as an overlay. April 26th is a good example of that.

That took a lot of time as I was correcting each drawing systematically. This meant I was doing very few drawings and spent a lot of time correcting instead.

So I switched to trying to do as many as possible of the same pose until I can draw it fairly perfectly. I started doing that on April 30th.

Quote:How long do you spend on these?

Four hours but that's for my whole practice. I figure this is probably slow but I'm trying to pick up the pace. For instance, I did 3 on April 29th, 10 on April 30th, 24 on May 1st and 17 on May 2nd. I am under the impression I should crunch those at a faster rate (2 minutes for each drawing). But I set aside four hours every day to practice.

Quote:What's your primary goal with these figure studies, is it to draw what you see accurately, or maybe to understand the human figure?

I'm hoping I'm practicing a lot of things at once:

1. Better line control.
2. Better hand-eye coordination.
3. Understand the human figure (proportions, shapes, anatomy), etc...
4. Better understand space.

Quote:but then, what do you do to solve these inaccuracies as they arise in the next drawing?

I usually think:
-"No that's wrong, try again" and keep going like this. I notice I usually mess up the size of the head of the legs.

Quote:begin to build up to more tonal drawings?
I added shapes to try to cram as much practice in to be honest and so I wouldn't be too bored doing the same thing over and over again.

Quote: Do you attempt to measure and check during each drawing or only check and measure more specifically once a drawing is done?

I used to check as I go along but I now check after the drawing is done. I also want to free myself from the fear of making mistakes or showing other people that I'm doing mistakes which is why I show everything.

Quote:Is there a specific process or guidance you are following here?

No guidance, well, not exactly. Mariyan and I have decided to part ways from the tutoring as I essentially need to practice the basics repeatedly on my own. I used to have the assignment of drawing 10 figures a day but since I'm on my own I've switched that around as explained above.

By all means though, since I aim to draw similar things to you I am very, very interested into any exercise suggestions you might have since I'm winging it right now. I could probably be more efficient at this.

If you were to suggest doing x, y and z every day, I most likely would do it.
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Practice for today. I've tried changing the background to what was previously suggested.
[Image: DMkg76P.jpg]
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