THE CRIMSON CADAVERS

[Tristan Berndt]

appleseed - Hey, to be honest, I don't really see how you're learning much from that study. I think you'd be better off just drawing the things you want to learn. It saves you way more time and once you've learned it, sculpting should be much easier. You don't need to make things harder than it is :)

Also, one of the best ways to learn horse anatomy is to learn human anatomy and apply that to a horse. We have a common ancestor with horses and at that point, basically all the muscles and bones are in place. The main difference is the shape and size. Hoofs are basically the toe of a horse. On a skeleton you can see that the humerus, radius and ulna are much higher up than on most mammals. 

The link you provided isn't relevant to anatomy. It's just 3D models of figures so that's why I am not adding it to the resource section. 

Grieverjoe - Hey man. It's cool that you want to draw from a Houdon sculpture but I think you need to learn about all the muscles before you try and draw something that complex. Just copying something with anatomy isn't the same as studying anatomy. You can't approach it like most other subjects. It's like advanced perspective. You just need to learn it from a non-artist perspective. 

---

Have a bunch of client work to do so I don't have as much study time I'd like. I'm also working on finding a place to live. Still, I've managed to do a few studies.

[appleseed00]

hi buddy,

thnx for the critique, although i disagree with the statement i think its important to consider these things.

yep horses are pretty awesome.

Though the hoof is more like a fingernail. Its made of the same material (keratin) and it covers the bone, (like a fingernail).

Yea i uh didnt check it that much, :D.

The skulls and the figure are really nice great job!

Figure:
Abdominals are symmetrical, but should be placed assymetrically.
The Lat on the figures right looks a little strange.
I cant see the greater trochanter, tho i might have missed it.

Great idea to indicate all the landmarks.
The Knee doesnt look right, the patella needs to be indicated. and the lower part of the tibula. These are landmarks.

Edit: I can now see that they have been indicated.


The sternum is covered by the pectoral muscles when they should be attaching to it not over it.

Edit 2: also checked this out it seems fine.



Hope this helps keep up the great work! :D

[Olooriel]

@Olooriel. I think that is fantastic. Taking feedback like a boss!

@Amit Dutta
Hehe, thanks a lot! :D

Olooriel - I really didn't expect that... Damn, you tackled that critique head on! That's really a lot better relative to your last post. Some further minor critiques is that the femurs are a little wide and bulky at the knees. The iliac (hip bones) is somewhat crunched. It's one of the harder areas of the figure and fairly difficult to get right. If you look at some reference and try to do a few more, just focusing on that area I think you'll get it right! You might also like to draw the hipbones separately a few times to get familiar with their complicated shape.

@Tristan Berndt
That's what I'm here for, isn't it? ;)
Yes, that drawing made me realise that I really didn't understand the hips... will pay closer attention to those on the next ones. Thanks for the critique!

@Adam Lina
Thanks a lot for the feedback, I'll have a closer look at the knees...

For now I've done a more detailed study of the hips, trying to understand the 3d shapes:


And some skulls, hoping to improve my faces:




EDIT
I also tried to fix the mistakes you pointed out before moving on to another one, and I think the knees and elbows are better now? I still have trouble understanding the shape of the hips though :/

[appleseed00]

Olooriel:

These are great studies! Just pay attention to the forms, the proportions. This can be really hard with bones, so get good reference. I think its great that you labelled the parts this will really help in the future.

With your skull study, there are many things you can do to improve.

Proportions
Accurate perspective
Accurate Shading


The figure Study:

Its hard to see the parts of the bones, so its hard to work out whats going on.
The collarbone looks a little misshaped. it should be curved not straight.
You can think of the pelvis like a box shape. tilted forward.
Great job on the legs in particular the knee this is a very difficult area and you nailed it :D

Edit: Removed, placed in reply.

[Olooriel]

@appleseed00
Thank you for the feedback, I was having a pretty hard time with the proportions, bones are such weird shapes :/
Adding the labels made the exercise feel oddly familiar, like studying for my exams, lol

Now that I look at it again, today's skeleton study is way too rough... will have to go back over it and clean up the details, but probably not today...


EDIT - attempted to draw a cleaner and more detailed version, didn't really succed:

[appleseed00]

The Skeleton seems fine, yes the bones are weird shapes i like to think of them as more like machine parts. Each designed to fulfil a specific purpose.

This skeleton seems fine most of the stuff is in the right place cant see any errors.

perhaps its time to move on to more challenging things?

Horse Skeletal Studies:

Heres what i been working on for the past week.
It now has a black background to fit in with the forum theme.

[Adam Lina]

Awesome horse skeletons, appleseed!

Olooriel, I did a draw over. Finally got my yiynova working again and had to get used to Manga Studio. This was mostly a fun exercise for me but hopefully you get something out of it. I tried to show the basic forms of the bones with accuracy placed on proportions and perspective. I reduced the femoral epicondyles to their basic form of cylinders. The epicondyles roll on top of the tibial plateau below it. A good starting reference point to find first is the tibial tuberosity. You can easily find it on your own knee as the boney bulge that marks the top of the shin. The patellar tendon (that keeps the knee cap hovering over the front exposed side of the femoral epicondyles) connects to the tibial tuberosity. The tibial tuberosity also roughly lines up with the head of the fibula on the outside (lateral side) of the knee.

I suggest anyone trying to learn anatomy to not resist picking up on the technical terms. You dont have to sit down and study them like your studying for your finals to become a doctor. Knowing the names to specific parts like tibial tuberosity adds the needed understanding to really make you drawings accurate. If you dont have a name for something that means you easily forget its there and end up leaving it out of drawings. So start the habit of labeling major landmarks.

[Bookend]

Hey guys, I was under the impression that I could dive right in.  Finding this group rocks, 'cause my goals right now are pretty anatomical in nature.

I'm doing 88 hand/arm studies from ref, and 88 from memory/imagination by September 20th, so any tips and tricks would be awesome.  I'm moving on to the feet/legs after that, if all goes well.

I hope it's okay if I put all 5 images that I've done so far.  If I should be reducing my input so it's not overwhelming, just let me know.

SNE = My silly abbreviation meaning, 'see no evil'. Means it's from memory.
From ref = From reference

[Amit Dutta]

Hey bookend, I think this group has died a bit. Tristan is busy getting ready for his atelier and moving. I can't contribute much. In terms of your work, I think you should pay special attention to your proportions. Your arms look way too short. Perhaps you should draw with them next to whatever reference you are using to compare.

A good tip is that the arm proportions generally follow Fibonacci ratios. each joint is approximately 1.6 times the length of the precending one starting from fingernail length to the shoulder.
http://www.goldennumber.net/human-hand-foot/

[appleseed00]

Another dead group lol.
I might be able to post some stuff soon.

Bookend: You dont have to force yourself to draw it from memory, you can use reference it is fine :D. Concentrate on understanding the forms, shapes etc. Pay special attention to proportions.

Focus on Quality first, then once you have achieved that then do quantity.

[Tristan Berndt]

Soooo, yeah. I'm not gonna have a lot of time for the group. I'm at the atelier 11-12 hours every day and on the weekend I need to cook food for the week, do laundry and that kind of stuff (also doing weekend life drawing at the atelier). A lot to deal with and it doesn't leave me with a lot (or any) free time. Kinda sucks because I'd like to run the Cadavers group but I feel like I have to prioritise my learning at the atelier first.

Maybe I'll jump in during my break (in december) and run a quick "Anatomy" or "Academic Life Drawing" mentorship thing but I can't really do much intill then.

Hopefully someone keeps the blood of the Crimson Cadavers pumping or at the very least, encourages people to study anatomy a bit more.

Anyway, I'll leave you all with my wonderful motto:

Get Good <3

[neopatogen]

I found some awesome tips on anatomy studies here, so I will probably post relevant stuff in this group. 
Would be great if someone else learning anatomy joins :)
First is anatomy tracing assignment from Proko homework, 2nd is an ecorche based on a ref https://hu.pinterest.com/pin/361765782552486914/, but I also used ref from portrait class and some anatomy books to check the ref accuracy, draw muscles in a most understandable (for me) way or some missing muscles and to see insertions. I see that no one wrote muscle names here. I just do it to memorise them cause it helps with finding same muscles in animal anatomy. I did not s platysma because it would cover too many other interesting muscles.

[Artloader]

Awesome!  I was browsing this thread last month hoping it was still alive since I've been studying anatomy on and off for a few months now.

Seeing as you've resurrected this Neo, I'll join in as best I can :).

Great studies there Neo - I can't really comment on your head Écorché painting since I haven't studied the head muscles yet, but as far as I can tell, your anatomy tracing of the guy's upper body looks good.  One thing you might have included was part of the serratus anterior on the right side of his rib cage.

Nice going - let's keep it up!

Here's a study I did in my SB of the serratus anterior and the erector spinae:

[Artloader]

Had a go at an écorché - I can really see how these studies would boost your anatomy knowledge!