MagneticScrolls Sketchbook - Starting from the beginning again
#41
Here the approch i suggest.

Just work using line no cross hatching allowed when you block in shadow don't use gradation simply use a flat value.

Step 1
From each corner of the frame of the image draw one diagonal really lightly going to the opposite corner of the frame
Now you should have an a big x that made you find the center of the image it really important not to over look the importance of the middle of the image it an important point you will need for further step.

Step 2
Now you can draw 2 line one vertical and one horizontal those line will meet the center of the image.

Optional step
Is to also useful determine the center of each quadran for extra precision it might be good to do this step on more complex subject matter.

Step 3
You should now have 4 equal square or rectangle we will refer as to quadran.

Step 4
Find 3 really simple shape that would best encapsulate the outline of the subject.Try to simplify using straight angle and or big curvy line don't get to lost to early into the detail that where everything can go wrong.

Step 5
Find shadow mass that can help you connect and capture the space between shape.Use a the side of lead pencil to block in flat value.

Step 6
Try to create shape by finding where area of light and shadow meet.

Helpful note

Alway find the angle of the nose to find the angle of the head in relation to the body.

You can than use that angle to construct the feature of the face as a center line

Try to think in term of 3 to 5 grey tone alway tell yourself is this a strong dark or is this a zone that is receiving alot of light.

Adjust the value as you go checking to never go darker than the image alway go lighter at first but finish with strong dark.

This process can be use to start many study.Not only portrait.

One of the most important thing is to mark point inside the 4 quadrant so that you can connect those point to create curve and line that will be turn into shape.It important to practice creating and find point inside quadrant. This practice accuracy.

Thing to be aware of
Is the framing is it horizontale or verticale?

What is the biggest shape inside one of the quadran the negative or positive shape.Do this for each quadran this will help you determine the biggest form. Choosing the biggest shape help find proportion error faster it harder to detect angle and proportion error on small shape.That why you want to find the biggest shape between the negative shape and the positive shape.

For example inside the quadran 1 we could say without a doubt it easier to determine the negative shape (background) not because it flat but because it occupy more of the space inside the first quadran.


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My Sketchbook
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#42
(03-05-2018, 11:37 AM)darktiste Wrote: Here what i propose you do to think of when doing study like those first of you want to have the composition right so that you can have a better grip of the porportion of the subject

Fist check the image and visually separate the background from the character into 2 shape those are the 2 main form 
split the image into 4 cadran.

Next step find the 3 really simple form that would best encapsulate the outline of the subject.If you can try to simplify using straight angle and or big curvy line.

Find shadow mass that can help you connect and capture the space between shape.

Try to use area where light and shadow meet to create more shape

Before this stage you don't need to blocking any grey just work in outline using line.

Alway find the angle of the nose to find the angle of the head in relation to the body.

You can than use that angle to construct the feature of the face as a center line

One you have establish enought you can than start to think in term of value working light than gradually working to push the contrast into the darker grey


Try to think in term of 3 to 5 grey tone alway tell yourself is this a strong dark or is this a zone that is receiving alot of light

Adjust the value as you go checking to never go darker than the image alway go lighter at first but finish with strong dark

This process is manly use do what is call value study but it will also help gain better proportion and understanding of composition
Alright I gave it a try in the next few portraits but, I can't help but feel like I failed to actually pull it off.

Still working on portraits. My shading is still pretty bad. Proportions need a ton of work. The faces ended up looking flat and skewed which I really detest.

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On a small note, I'm having trouble having fun with things...
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I feel like I don't have the required skill to pull off whatever I'm attemtping. I start to think that maybe I should contiune studies instead of trying my own projects.
This drawing turned out poorly. I tried to create a semi - realistic looking alleyway at night (using reference) with a portal in back being the object that was projecting light. There is no indication the thing is back is a portal so it really doesn't look good at all.
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#43
One thing i would say is it normal that the fun is drifting away but don't let it discourage you when you attack area of incomfort it is only normal to feel like it a the end of the world but if you focus on learning instead of seeing all the little thing that get in the way you allready set to allow yourself to succed in those study.It normal that it can be frustrating after a few attemp that the result are not coming as fast as you want it but sometime it just that you didn't try long enought to understand what is not working .It help a great deal to have a strong understanding of the anatomy of the face first atleast to be able to represent the head in different position and to be able to locate and place the feature of the face realisticly but what will really is when you reach the point you understand how each part of the face merge into one an other creating value change.

I think you can learn a great deal by stepping away from a drawing and coming back later on and trying to find what went wrong.
I don't know if you can see it yourself but there is a progression of the confidence you have at first you seem to draw from memory rather than looking at the reference than something seem to change because you seem to realise you fall into the trap of drawing to much from memory you seem to be taking more time to draw what you see on the reference you even taking small note of what was wrong for example you decided to redraw the eye that was a smart move keep taking those kind of note and you will progress lighting fast.

I don't personnaly recommend drawing film from old era even if they come in white and black because the quality of the light aren't that great.If you have photoshop i recommend you learn how to turn a colored image into it greyscale version there tutorial on that i am pretty sure you can find it pretty easly.

My Sketchbook
The journey of an artist truly begin when he can learn from is own error.
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#44
I just wanted to make a quick note. Black and white movies are great to study broad light and shadow and value blocking schemes. Any first year film / cinematography student is taught this because those moviemakers HAD to work to compose the 'values' and lights specifically for a colour free medium; whereas colour films have another dimension to them. And ofc hitchcock films are brilliantly shot as are many other film noir movies, so don't worry about that. thanks for the link actually, i hadn't seen that before...so many great compositional shots to learn from! Try some quick studies using simplification down to only 2 to 4 specific values in flat areas, focusing on the overall read. it's good for compositional and broad value arrangement practice

as for having fun....try harder....to let your toxic self criticism go. it's not a good sign if you can't enjoy drawing. i wouldn't get used to that. seriously, why are you doing it in the first place then? the answer won't lie in better skills. it's in your head.

 YouTube free learnin! | DeviantArt | Old Folio | Insta
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#45
(03-19-2018, 12:26 PM)darktiste Wrote: One thing i would say is it normal that the fun is drifting away but don't let it discourage you when you attack area of incomfort it is only normal to feel like it a the end of the world but if you focus on learning instead of seeing all the little thing that get in the way you allready set to allow yourself to succed in those study.It normal that it can be frustrating after a few attemp that the result are not coming as fast as you want it but sometime it just that you didn't try long enought to understand what is not working .It help a great deal to have a strong understanding of the anatomy of the face first atleast to be able to represent the head in different position and to be able to locate and place the feature of the face realisticly but what will really is when you reach the point you understand how each part of the face merge into one an other creating value change.

I think you can learn a great deal by stepping away from a drawing and coming back later on and trying to find what went wrong.
I don't know if you can see it yourself but there is a progression of the confidence you have at first you seem to draw from memory rather than looking at the reference than something seem to change because you seem to realise you fall into the trap of drawing to much from memory you seem to be taking more time to draw what you see on the reference you even taking small note of what was wrong for example you decided to redraw the eye that was a smart move keep taking those kind of note and you will progress lighting fast.

I don't personnaly recommend drawing film from old era even if they come in white and black because the quality of the light aren't that great.If you have photoshop i recommend you learn how to turn a colored image into it greyscale version there tutorial on that i am pretty sure you can find it pretty easly.
When I step back from my work, for hours (or days) sometimes all I notice is that my work is just horribly off, not how. Learning what exactly is wrong is what is giving me so much trouble. It is so frustrating to simply learn there is something horribly wrong here but, not what.

As far as the images, what would you suggest I use then? I already know how to make them greyscale but, i thought these would be a good source. They appear to having good lighting to me.


(03-25-2018, 04:59 PM)Amit Dutta Wrote: I just wanted to make a quick note. Black and white movies are great to study broad light and shadow and value blocking schemes. Any first year film / cinematography student is taught this because those moviemakers HAD to work to compose the 'values' and lights specifically for a colour free medium; whereas colour films have another dimension to them. And ofc hitchcock films are brilliantly shot as are many other film noir movies, so don't worry about that. thanks for the link actually, i hadn't seen that before...so many great compositional shots to learn from! Try some quick studies using simplification down to only 2 to 4 specific values in flat areas, focusing on the overall read. it's good for compositional and broad value arrangement practice

as for having fun....try harder....to let your toxic self criticism go. it's not a good sign if you can't enjoy drawing. i wouldn't get used to that. seriously, why are you doing it in the first place then? the answer won't lie in better skills. it's in your head.
I found the link to the site from another forum and thought it might make a good source. The director knows what he's doing and these images are really good for portraits - though for more action related shots or figure drawing I would need something else.
My values obviously still need work but, I'm far more concerned about the accuracy of my construction lines and line work. I still have trouble with those and it seems to be deeply effecting my drawings.
It's just so frustrating when I don't see any progress.

I've been watching a few videos on youtube like this one:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h8x_TClXuxM
Unfortunately the lessons seem to fly above my head. At this point I'm considering hiring someone locally to help me learn the very basics since I have not gotten far on my own.




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#46
I think it important for anyone that want to see real progress to be open about the idea of sharing what there currently studying .Sure there is a big problem in understanding how to move in the right direction.I think what is important is you develop a solid understanding on what fundamental support other more complex fundamental.You got to understand what is the root of a problem to solve it but you can't do it all by yourself there no need to be frustrated we are here to offer advice it up to you to be honest with yourself and to try to see if we offer you something that is gonna push you in the right direction.

I got a few suggestion of post i made that you might find interesting to lift you up and identify some problem you might be facing.

Positive thinking
http://crimsondaggers.com/forum/thread-6483.html
How to increase optimal workflow(the theory)
http://crimsondaggers.com/forum/thread-5494.html
W.p The artist sin
http://crimsondaggers.com/forum/thread-4785.html
Remember that progress come with working smart and it still hard work don't get me wrong.No magic trick involve.

Sometime as artist we hit a plateau but it important to alway remember that being inside the problem prevent us from thinking outside the box that why i advice to take break when you sense something ain't right but you can't put you finger on it.Walk way from the work place and come back a few minute later if you can afford it.
This help you see you work as if it was the first time you seen it.The more advance technique use in digital media is to often zoom out and flip the canva it help show flaw of a drawing.

You can't be simply observing an error once you see it you know it wrong so therefore you should know what fundamental what not sucessfully use in that piece.It then just a question of understanding what are the fundamental that are the weakest in those piece.

For the video you watching i would not advice to watch moderndayjames tutorial because he as a really strong draftmanship but he doesn't clearly define a process that is easy to interpret.He as no problem drawing without construction and as strong visualisation skill i advice you watch people who can show you how to construct more in depth he really simplify stuff and make it look easy.

I advice this guy instead.

https://www.youtube.com/user/LighterNoteProd/videos

Don't be scared to go look into is older video he as alot of content that you might be missing if you don't dig up.He will really teach you how to think in term of volume.But not only that so check him out.

My Sketchbook
The journey of an artist truly begin when he can learn from is own error.
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#47
This sb has devolved into us spewing resources and technique exercises at you and i think this is becoming an issue. I don't want to continue this trend, however did you download and watch the dorien iten vids/gumroads i linked in my first post or not?

If not, please, before you watch anything else get the accuracy training one which is totally free and also his free articles on values and even the other paid series of vids. These resources are 1000 times better and more concise than most you'll find online and I've seen a lot. He is a traditional atelier trained artist and he gets to the point quickly. Use the accuracy training guide to help with your portrait studies and any other observed studies immediately. Your observational skills need to be increased first. If you cannot judge an angle or measure relative distances of something that is directly in front of you then no amount of construction is going to help you.

This will directly help with your general draftsmanship as well. Do it. And as to getting a mentor i think you should start to look into it. You seem like you would do better with personalised instruction. Or Look into atelier courses near you if you can as they will give you the best foundation.

 YouTube free learnin! | DeviantArt | Old Folio | Insta
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#48
Amit is right here. The issue is accuracy, which is itself a training in seeing accurately. You must be able to break what you see down into a puzzle of shapes. The well-known exercise is to draw something upside-down. Somehow this exercise tends to convince people to trust what they see more than using their own guesswork. And once you have done that, hopefully you will learn to trust what you see. This guy explains it well, but you don't have to watch the whole video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XHPEv5wu...u.be&t=634

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#49
It's been a while. I wanted to post something substantial but, I found the quality of my work was not improving as much as I would have hoped.  Unfortunately too much time has passed since I last posted. It might be better if I post something of poor quality rather than nothing at all.
(04-17-2018, 12:29 PM)darktiste Wrote: I think it important for anyone that want to see real progress to be open about the idea of sharing what there currently studying .Sure there is a big problem in understanding how to move in the right direction.I think what is important is you develop a solid understanding on what fundamental support other more complex fundamental.You got to understand what is the root of a problem to solve it but you can't do it all by yourself there no need to be frustrated we are here to offer advice it up to you to be honest with yourself and to try to see if we offer you something that is gonna push you in the right direction.

I got a few suggestion of post i made that you might find interesting to lift you up and identify some problem you might be facing.

Positive thinking
http://crimsondaggers.com/forum/thread-6483.html
How to increase optimal workflow(the theory)
http://crimsondaggers.com/forum/thread-5494.html
W.p The artist sin
http://crimsondaggers.com/forum/thread-4785.html
Remember that progress come with working smart and it still hard work don't get me wrong.No magic trick involve.

Sometime as artist we hit a plateau but it important to alway remember remember that being inside the problem prevent us from thinking outside the box that why i advice to take break when you sense something ain't right but you can't put you finger on it.Walk way from the work place and come back a few minute later if you can afford it.
This help you see you work as if it was the first time you seen it.The more advance technique use in digital media is to often zoom out and flip the canva it help show flaw of a drawing.

You can't be simply observing an error once you see it because you know it wrong so therefore you should know what fundamental what not sucessfully use in that piece.It than just a question of understanding what are the fundamental that are the weakest in those piece.

For the video you watching i would not advice to watch moderndayjames tutorial because he as a really strong draftmanship but he doesn't clearly define a process that is easy to interpret.He as no problem drawing without construction and as strong visualisation skill i advice you watch people who can show you how to construct more in depth he really simplfy stuff and make it look easy.

I advice this guy instead.

https://www.youtube.com/user/LighterNoteProd/videos

Don't be scared to go look into is older video he as alot of content that you might be missing if you don't dig up.He will really teach you how to think in term of volume.But not only that so check him out.
I'm giving these a look. I do need to improve how productive I am with my time. Quiet frequently I find myself frustrated and confused. As I have said before, I will know that there is a problem with my work and it looks entirely wrong but, I don't know how to fix it.

(04-17-2018, 03:59 PM)Amit Dutta Wrote: This sb has devolved into us spewing resources and technique exercises at you and i think this is becoming an issue.  I don't want to continue this trend, however did you download and watch the dorien iten vids/gumroads i linked in my first post or not?

 If not, please, before you watch anything else get the accuracy training one which is totally free and also his free articles on values and even the other paid series of vids. These resources are 1000 times better and more concise than most you'll find online and I've seen a lot.  He is a traditional atelier trained artist and he gets to the point quickly. Use the accuracy training guide to help with your portrait studies and any other observed studies immediately. Your observational skills need to be increased first. If you cannot judge an angle or measure relative distances of something that is directly in front of you then no amount of construction is going to help you.

This will directly help with your general draftsmanship as well. Do it. And as to getting a mentor i think you should start to look into it. You seem like you would do better with personalised instruction. Or Look into atelier courses near you if you can as they will give you the best foundation.
My apologies. I've been trying to find the root of the issues I'm having with learning how to draw. I might be interpreting this the wrong way but, I end up finding out there are prerequisites to the things i want to learn and when I try to learn those things there are prerequisites to those too.
I have been going over the free video as well as "Accuracy - A Drawing Guide". I've been trying to work on my measurements and proportions as best I can.

I searched for a couple of things. The first was an Atelier or something like one. My searches have brought up nothing though. Asking around places I only get the names of classes I have already been to.
There was a website that did bring up something, ARC (Art Renewal Center). However that glimmer of hope that it brought me was quickly dashed. The nearest instructed courses are about 200 miles away.

As for a mentor, I'm not quiet sure about how to search for one. I posted an ad up on one of the bulletin boards at one of the art supply stores near my house. I haven't seen anyone post an ad like what I'm asking for there but, there are classes so I assume this is the right way to go about doing this.



(04-17-2018, 04:19 PM)ThereIsNoJustice Wrote: Amit is right here. The issue is accuracy, which is itself a training in seeing accurately. You must be able to break what you see down into a puzzle of shapes. The well-known exercise is to draw something upside-down. Somehow this exercise tends to convince people to trust what they see more than using their own guesswork. And once you have done that, hopefully you will learn to trust what you see. This guy explains it well, but you don't have to watch the whole video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XHPEv5wu...u.be&t=634
Yes, without some degree of accuracy I'm not going to get anywhere. I need to improve my ability to draw what I see before i can really see any sort of real improvement.



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#50
I think you should avoid redrawing multiple time the same figure and try to be more accurate the first time.

Here what I suggest.Draw the head form a front view and get familiar with where each part of the face fall and are the proportion of space between each line.

Here the video to watch

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z4ZLkyTuX_w

Here is more in depth approch to drawing the face

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xh-LKm9cgqk

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fMalQC4KTZI

There an exercise i recommend find a newpaper and practice drawing over the face of the people inside with the REILLY METHOD


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My Sketchbook
The journey of an artist truly begin when he can learn from is own error.
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#51
(05-21-2018, 11:03 AM)darktiste Wrote: I think you should avoid redrawing multiple the same figure and try to be more accurate the first time.

Here what I suggest.Draw the head form a front view and get familiar with where each part of the face fall and are the proportion of space between each line.

Here the video to watch

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z4ZLkyTuX_w

Here is more in depth approch to drawing the face

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xh-LKm9cgqk

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fMalQC4KTZI

There an exercise i recommend find a new paper and practice drawing over the face of the people inside with the REILLY METHOD
I've been having trouble getting things right the first time. I just can't get consistent results. Sometimes I can pour over 9 hours into a piece and make it comes out looking terrible other times it is merely acceptable.
both The Reilly Method and what I've seen in the Proko videos remind me a lot of what I studied with Loomis. I'm trying to draw the face as best I can along with the videos but, i still feel like I'm missing something.

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#52
To be able to gain an understanding of the 3d aspect of the head you need to expand to drawing the head from the front view, profile and 3/4 view.

I think that instead of copying photo you should attempt to copy the construction of the head seen in the example i just provided.

You than need to draw over head inside new paper to solidify the principle.
After than you will be able to copy from photo but you still need to create the construction before laying in the detail.
Once you will have practice enough you will be able to visualize the construction without evend drawing it.

You better learn about the plane of the face before doing value study or you will not gain any result in the long term.
Plane will slowly turn into curved surface a way to understand curved plane is to think of a piece of paper

Like i suggested avoid drawing the same figure more than once try to aim for correct proportion instead if you mess up use an eraser.
You seem to be spending way to much time trying to copy value but you need to support that with an understanding of the construction of the face.

Remember this You can try to build a house but without a plan it meant to fail.
It the same thing with drawing face you need to understand the construction(plan) before build a good looking face(house)


Attached Files Image(s)



My Sketchbook
The journey of an artist truly begin when he can learn from is own error.
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#53
(06-12-2018, 09:11 AM)darktiste Wrote: To be able to gain an understanding of the 3d aspect of the head you need to expand to drawing the head from the front view, profile and 3/4 view.

I think that instead of copying photo you should attempt to copy the construction of the head seen in the example i just provided.

You than need to draw over head inside new paper to solidify the principle.
After than you will be able to copy from photo but you still need to create the construction before laying in the detail.
Once you will have practice enough you will be able to visualize the construction without evend drawing it.

You better learn about the plane of the face before doing value study or you will not gain any result in the long term.
Plane will slowly turn into curved surface a way to understand curved plane is to think of a piece of paper

Like i suggested avoid drawing the same figure more than once try to aim for correct proportion instead if you mess up use an eraser.
You seem to be spending way to much time trying to copy value but you need to support that with an understanding of the construction of the face.

Remember this You can try to build a house but without a plan it meant to fail.
It the same thing with drawing face you need to understand the construction(plan) before build a good looking face(house)

I have been attempting to construct the head. I'm using what I've learned from  Andrew Loomis's book Drawing the Head and hands, unfortunately I don't seem to be grasping it very well at all. In every portrait I try I need to make massive adjustments to proportion after I place the face over the Loomis construct.
I'm still struggling with proportion and angles. Construction in general seems to be quiet difficult for me. My draftsmanship still needs work as well.

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#54
Just be more mindful of he centerline it will help you know how much of each side of the face should be showing.Also keep the element of the face align with the centerline.Practice alway with reference to practice the construction of the head once you will have draw enough of them you will be able to invent your own head.Try drawing 100 head construct from reference as a challenge you don't need to go into shading just the overall placement of the element of the face.If you can a good idea is to try to sculpt the construction with molding clay to use to help visualize you can even use real clay and let it dry to make a permenent model.

My Sketchbook
The journey of an artist truly begin when he can learn from is own error.
Reply
#55
(07-09-2018, 10:08 AM)darktiste Wrote: Just be more mindful of he centerline it will help you know how much of each side of the face should be showing.Also keep the element of the face align with the centerline.Practice alway with reference to practice the construction of the head once you will have draw enough of them you will be able to invent your own head.Try drawing 100 head  construct from reference as a challenge you don't need to go into shading just the overall placement of the element of the face.If you can a good idea is to try to sculpt the construction with molding clay to use to help visualize you can even use real clay and let dry to make a permenent model.
I'll need to work on the 100 heads this week. I wanted to see if spending more time on the construction phase would help. It does not seem to. I suppose I just need more practice in this area in order to better understand it.
Sculpting - haha, I tried that before but, found out it's much more difficult that I had imagined. I may just need to buy a small bust or something instead.

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#56
I'm still not accurate with these photographs. I'm having a lot of trouble getting basic features down. Quiet frequently I need to redraw features like lips and eyes over several times again.

The heads - I have about 30 images at the end that are my attempts at drawing a basic head with no reference. I just could not pull it off. I spent a lot of time trying to measure angles and proportions but anytime the head looks up or down (and isn't in profile) I can't keep proportions properly.
I don't know what to do at this point. What do I need to do to improve? I feel completely lost.
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Reply
#57
The studies are getting better. I'm still unsure why the first versions are quite that much less accurate than the finals. You should try and get the accuracy down in one drawing as you go. If a line or angle or proportion looks off immediately correct the drawing as you go rather than practice all these sloppy attempts.  

The issues with the imagination heads are many most of all perspective and proportions.
You need to be able to visualise and draw a basic box rotating in order to draw angled/rotated heads (or anything) well. This is what the drawabox basic exercises were to help for really. The next step might be to draw simplified heads as if oriented inside the box. You can combine the exercise such as drawing these asaro heads (all angles)within the correctly oriented box..but you must slow down and try and go for general overall accuracy and start just with line drawings and getting them correct before you even think about value

[Image: head_references_by_snuvi-d4v6vc0.jpg]
The point of accuracy studies is not simply to copy 1:1 but to really actively analyse and learn from what you are observing be it proportion or perspective or shapes. Check your work against the originals carefully. Make notes of what you notice and what errors you made and what are repeated so you know what to fix. If you wing it every time without thinking well..improvement will be mich slower.
You also seem to be thinking about features in symbolic ways still instead of learning from the observation studies what shapes features actually make.
If you don't get used to using your brain to actually identify very specific concrete issues in your drawings and fix them you will not be able to improve as fast.

Post work in the discord. Feedback will be better and faster than you will usually get in the forum.

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#58
Yo man! Good to see that you´re studying the classics i.e. classic movies portraiture.
Did a very simple breakdown to help you consider 2 things; simple breakdown of value but firstly, proportion and measurements.
Try a Andrew Loomis, it will help you greatly.
Cheers!!



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#59
Well good job you almost did 100 but the goal is not the number it the quality what drawing book you have to study from?Maybe i can help you progress in a logical way in those book.

Did you draw from reference of from imagination?

I recommend you take the image Amit dutta gave you and take the time to apply the construction to those head also.You don't necessarly have to add the indication of light for the moment because you need to focus on the construction that are is still fragile.

And to compliment the construction from imagination you need to also supplement with drawing from life to understand the feature and the relation of the element of the face.

I recommend that you construct the head from reference instead of imagination for the moment and you assign a number to each head to relate it to a reference image.

The point i wanna stress is reference,construction,accuracy,no shadow or light.

You got good result at the begin of the 100 but you seem to have lost patience overtime it not a race.

My Sketchbook
The journey of an artist truly begin when he can learn from is own error.
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#60
(08-19-2018, 09:48 PM)Amit Dutta Wrote: The studies are getting better. I'm still unsure why the first versions are quite that much less accurate than the finals. You should try and get the accuracy down in one drawing as you go. If a line or angle or proportion looks off immediately correct the drawing as you go rather than practice all these sloppy attempts.  

The issues with the imagination heads are many most of all perspective and proportions.
You need to be able to visualise and draw a basic box rotating in order to draw angled/rotated heads (or anything) well. This is what the drawabox basic exercises were to help for really. The next step might be to draw simplified heads as if oriented inside the box. You can combine the exercise such as drawing these asaro heads (all angles)within the correctly oriented box..but you must slow down and try and go for general overall accuracy and start just with line drawings and getting them correct before you even think about value

[Image: head_references_by_snuvi-d4v6vc0.jpg]
The point of accuracy studies is not simply to copy 1:1 but to really actively analyse and learn from what you are observing be it proportion or perspective or shapes. Check your work against the originals carefully. Make notes of what you notice and what errors you made and what are repeated so you know what to fix. If you wing it every time without thinking well..improvement will be mich slower.
You also seem to be thinking about features in symbolic ways still instead of learning from the observation studies what shapes features actually make.
If you don't get used to using your brain to actually identify very specific concrete issues in your drawings and fix them you will not be able to improve as fast.

Post work in the discord. Feedback will be better and faster than you will usually get in the forum.
I'm having a hard time with the draw a box lessons. I found them to be extremely difficult and confusing. I don't recall learning much from them at all.

The biggest problem I run into is the fact that I spend hours trying to figure out whats wrong with what I've just drawn only to come up with "everything looks wrong.". I can walk alway and come back only to find the same thing.

On the subject on note taking, can you show me some good examples on the proper way to do this. I'm willing to give it a try since I can't seem to correct everything.

I'll try to post my work on discord. It just looks like everyone else there is so much farther along than I am.

(08-19-2018, 09:57 PM)RickRichards Wrote: Yo man! Good to see that you´re studying the classics i.e. classic movies portraiture.
Did a very simple breakdown to help you consider 2 things; simple breakdown of value but firstly, proportion and measurements.
Try a Andrew Loomis, it will help you greatly.
Cheers!!
I do have tons of trouble with proportions and measurement. I'm trying to work on it as best I can yet I continue to get it wrong.
Yes I tried Andrew Loomis. The heads I posted earlier are based off of what I have learned from his studies.

(08-20-2018, 06:19 AM)darktiste Wrote: Well good job you almost did 100 but the goal is not the number it the quality what drawing book you have to study from?Maybe i can help you progress in a logical way in those book.

Did you draw from reference of from imagination?

I recommend you take the image Amit dutta gave you and take the time to apply the construction to those head also.You don't necessarly have to add the indication of light for the moment because you need to focus on the construction that are is still fragile.

And to compliment the construction from imagination you need to also supplement with drawing from life to understand the feature and the relation of the element of the face.

I recommend that you construct the head from reference instead of imagination for the moment and you assign a number to each head to relate it to a reference image.

The point i wanna stress is reference,construction,accuracy,no shadow or light.

You got good result at the begin of the 100 but you seem to have lost patience overtime it not a race.
Ah those heads were from imagination. I formed them by drawing a sphere then the brow line (or rather the center line/circle of the sphere, first horizontal then vertical).
I did lose my patience since these were taking a lot longer than i felt was necessary. Unfortunately it didn't work out too well.
I really do want to improve on my accuracy and construction but, I feel like there is something I'm missing or not doing.


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It's been a while since I posted. I've been busy with various things; Unfortunately, in spite of my efforts, I have not made any progress towards finding anyone to mentor me. I really wanted to find someone who could walk me through some of the more basic parts that I was having trouble with but, I just can't find anyone. I tried speaking with people who work in art supply stores but they lead me back to the local classes I've already taken.
The only thing I've really learned is that the city I live in does not care about representational art at all.  Why is it so hard to find? Are things like commercial illustration a lost art?
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